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Post by nu5ncbigred on Oct 22, 2022 2:38:32 GMT -5
The Truth of Christianity Isn’t Measured by People’s Hatred of It Amy K. Hall We have a tendency to think that when we make someone angry with our words or actions, we’ve done something wrong. That’s not an entirely bad tendency, of course — often, as fallen human beings, when we upset others, we have done something wrong and need to engage in some self-reflection and apologies. But this reflexive tendency becomes a problem when someone else’s anger towards our Christian words or actions causes us to conclude either that 1) we haven’t expressed ourselves well enough or, worse, 2) that Christianity itself is hateful, or ugly, or false. Conclusions That Don’t Necessarily Follow It’s vitally important to remember that those conclusions don’t necessarily follow. In terms of the first, no one has ever expressed himself as lovingly, truthfully, and wisely as Jesus, yet clearly many hated Him. As for Christianity’s truthfulness, at the very least, people’s hatred isn’t evidence of its falsity. In fact, the opposite may be true, as a new theist (though not yet Christian) recently told me, to my surprise. He said the evidence for Christianity he found to be most compelling was its wisdom about how to live well, which results in people’s anger towards it: In modern society, vice is championed as virtue and nearly everything elites want you to do is an inversion of what’s in the Bible. It also strikes me as odd that the Bible so accurately encapsulates the best way to lead a life. I think everyone knows this, and that’s why you see so much anger directed towards Christianity. I’ve been mulling this idea over for the past few weeks and then came across an illustration of the same point by Tim Challies in “Christian, Do You Expect to Face Persecution?” A few years ago one of my neighbors drank a bit too much and the next day he had a pretty bad hangover. He must have been lying in a darkened room with an icepack on his head while outside our kids and the neighbor kids were laughing and playing and enjoying some innocent childish fun. They were being good kids and having a good time. But suddenly the neighbor threw open his window and screamed “Make those kids be quiet!” His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution. Run With Endurance This idea is worth keeping in mind since you will need to counteract the tendency I described earlier with truth as the need arises. Please Support The Stream: Equipping Christians to Think Clearly About the Political, Economic, and Moral Issues of Our Day. Hebrews has much to say about not being pressured into abandoning the gospel, pointing to Jesus as our example, who did not turn aside from obedience, despite the ultimately lethal hatred of others: Let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, fixing our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God. For consider Him who has endured such hostility by sinners against Himself, so that you will not grow weary and lose heart. (Heb. 12:1–3) If you are going to be swayed from Christianity, let it be because you are no longer convinced by the evidence that it’s true, and not because of anyone’s reaction to it or a desire to be accepted by the people around you. First Peter’s message is clear: If you persevere, you will suffer now at the hands of men, but resurrection, glory, and eternal joy are all on the side of Jesus. Amy K. Hall is a Christian worldview and apologetics writer and podcaster at Stand to Reason, an organization that trains Christians to think more clearly about their faith and to make an even-handed, incisive, yet gracious defense for classical Christianity and classical Christian values in the public square. stream.org/the-truth-of-christianity-isnt-measured-by-peoples-hatred-of-it/ |
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Post by nu5ncbigred on Oct 22, 2022 2:42:18 GMT -5
The bottom line:
“ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution.
This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.”
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Post by Walter on Oct 22, 2022 6:02:22 GMT -5
The bottom line: “ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.” The problem is not your faith, nor is it the teachings of your 'savior'. It is your inability to follow the teaching of that faith. It is the perversion of those teachings used to evil purpose. It is the acceptance of that evil as the price to pay to gain political power. It is the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while acting in a wholly unchristian manner. It is the hypocrisy of following leaders who make a mockery of your faith by their words and actions and use unchristian means to achieve a political end that is at odds with the teachings of Jesus. When you have overcome those issues, come back and we can discuss persecution. But do not stand before us and use Jesus as a shield to protect you being called out for promoting evil. |
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Post by DrSchadenfreude on Oct 22, 2022 9:10:31 GMT -5
The bottom line: “ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.” The problem is not your faith, nor is it the teachings of your 'savior'. It is your inability to follow the teaching of that faith. It is the perversion of those teachings used to evil purpose. It is the acceptance of that evil as the price to pay to gain political power. It is the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while acting in a wholly unchristian manner. It is the hypocrisy of following leaders who make a mockery of your faith by their words and actions and use unchristian means to achieve a political end that is at odds with the teachings of Jesus. When you have overcome those issues, come back and we can discuss persecution. But do not stand before us and use Jesus as a shield to protect you being called out for promoting evil. Amen. Telling Big Lies, fomenting race-based hatred, harming the poor to enrich the wealthy, and facilitating our national epidemic of gun homicides is not Christian. Trump Republicons are pseudo-Christians. Period. |
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Post by nu5ncbigred on Oct 22, 2022 11:56:58 GMT -5
The bottom line: “ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.” The problem is not your faith, nor is it the teachings of your 'savior'. It is your inability to follow the teaching of that faith. It is the perversion of those teachings used to evil purpose. It is the acceptance of that evil as the price to pay to gain political power. It is the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while acting in a wholly unchristian manner. It is the hypocrisy of following leaders who make a mockery of your faith by their words and actions and use unchristian means to achieve a political end that is at odds with the teachings of Jesus. When you have overcome those issues, come back and we can discuss persecution. But do not stand before us and use Jesus as a shield to protect you being called out for promoting evil. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The church is not a place where perfect people gather. It is a place where spiritually sick people come together for healing. There will always be wolves in sheeps clothing, or hypocrites in the church. That there are hypocrites in the church is no defense before God to not believe. The wheat and weeds grow together until the end when.God sorts them out. It is not the hypocrites in the church that makes the sinner and the willful unbeliever uncomfortable in their ways where they lash out with persecution. It is the real thing, the genuine believer who does that. |
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Post by Walter on Oct 22, 2022 13:08:53 GMT -5
The problem is not your faith, nor is it the teachings of your 'savior'. It is your inability to follow the teaching of that faith. It is the perversion of those teachings used to evil purpose. It is the acceptance of that evil as the price to pay to gain political power. It is the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while acting in a wholly unchristian manner. It is the hypocrisy of following leaders who make a mockery of your faith by their words and actions and use unchristian means to achieve a political end that is at odds with the teachings of Jesus. When you have overcome those issues, come back and we can discuss persecution. But do not stand before us and use Jesus as a shield to protect you being called out for promoting evil. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The church is not a place where perfect people gather. It is a place where spiritually sick people come together for healing. There will always be wolves in sheeps clothing, or hypocrites in the church. That there are hypocrites in the church is no defense before God to not believe. The wheat and weeds grow together until the end when.God sorts them out. It is not the hypocrites in the church that makes the sinner and the willful unbeliever uncomfortable in their ways where they lash out with persecution. It is the real thing, the genuine believer who does that. I understand the notion of failure before God. The problem is when people of faith use the institution of faith as a shield to hide their foul actions and evil transgressions. The Catholic Church did that with wayward clergy for decades. Shining light on the evil promulgated by the faithful is not an attack on faith. It is an attack on evil. |
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Post by DrSchadenfreude on Oct 22, 2022 14:02:03 GMT -5
All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The church is not a place where perfect people gather. It is a place where spiritually sick people come together for healing. There will always be wolves in sheeps clothing, or hypocrites in the church. That there are hypocrites in the church is no defense before God to not believe. The wheat and weeds grow together until the end when.God sorts them out. It is not the hypocrites in the church that makes the sinner and the willful unbeliever uncomfortable in their ways where they lash out with persecution. It is the real thing, the genuine believer who does that. I understand the notion of failure before God. The problem is when people of faith use the institution of faith as a shield to hide their foul actions and evil transgressions. The Catholic Church did that with wayward clergy for decades. Shining light on the evil promulgated by the faithful is not an attack on faith. It is an attack on evil. Yes, and it's also an attack on the distortion and corruption of the faith by charlatans. |
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Post by Buckeye Dale on Oct 23, 2022 13:45:40 GMT -5
The bottom line: “ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.” We just finished a three-day conference, the theme was Be Ready ( Be a light in the darkness) Several visiting ministers spoke, and the last part yesterday concerned the 'false' ministers, who have been around since the beginning. Paul spoke of them many times in his writings. Today, the common, adopted term seems to be 'Progressive Christianity' and is pretty prevalent. There are some links to this on the Church's sites: redeemeraz.org/www.youtube.com/channel/UCenfIkvDIJa4Qb4WgsH8hkwwww.facebook.com/redeemeraz/ |
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Post by Walter on Oct 23, 2022 14:08:58 GMT -5
The bottom line: “ His condition made their joy painful to him; it made their expressions of happiness intolerable. And something like that happens when we become Christians and begin to live out God’s true design for humanity before other people. Our holiness confronts their sinfulness. They see Christians living as God truly made us to live, living in the joy of the Lord — and it challenges them; it confronts them; it convicts them. And many respond with hatred, with persecution. This persecution can be shown in attitude and insults; or it can be shown in imprisonment and death. But either way: it is the normal course of normal Christianity that we suffer for our faith. Citizens of the kingdom of heaven should expect to face persecution.” We just finished a three-day conference, the theme was Be Ready ( Be a light in the darkness) Several visiting ministers spoke, and the last part yesterday concerned the 'false' ministers, who have been around since the beginning. Paul spoke of them many times in his writings. Today, the common, adopted term seems to be 'Progressive Christianity' and is pretty prevalent. There are some links to this on the Church's sites: redeemeraz.org/www.youtube.com/channel/UCenfIkvDIJa4Qb4WgsH8hkwwww.facebook.com/redeemeraz/Speaking of false ministers...holy crap... redeemeraz.org/what-we-teach |
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Post by Buckeye Dale on Oct 23, 2022 15:50:55 GMT -5
Did you notice the bar/link at the top for questions? Ask your question and one of the ministers will attempt to help you understand. |
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Post by Walter on Oct 23, 2022 16:05:14 GMT -5
Did you notice the bar/link at the top for questions? Ask your question and one of the ministers will attempt to help you understand. They're an easy target but I'm not going to troll the guys . They have their screwball belief system and I'll leave them to it. PS: I know they are all guys spouting this nonsense because their website said so. No women allowed. |
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Post by Panama pfRedd on Oct 30, 2022 23:45:08 GMT -5
The problem is not your faith, nor is it the teachings of your 'savior'. It is your inability to follow the teaching of that faith. It is the perversion of those teachings used to evil purpose. It is the acceptance of that evil as the price to pay to gain political power. It is the hypocrisy of claiming to be Christian while acting in a wholly unchristian manner. It is the hypocrisy of following leaders who make a mockery of your faith by their words and actions and use unchristian means to achieve a political end that is at odds with the teachings of Jesus. When you have overcome those issues, come back and we can discuss persecution. But do not stand before us and use Jesus as a shield to protect you being called out for promoting evil. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The church is not a place where perfect people gather. It is a place where spiritually sick people come together for healing. There will always be wolves in sheeps clothing, or hypocrites in the church. That there are hypocrites in the church is no defense before God to not believe. The wheat and weeds grow together until the end when.God sorts them out. It is not the hypocrites in the church that makes the sinner and the willful unbeliever uncomfortable in their ways where they lash out with persecution. It is the real thing, the genuine believer who does that. Inspiring and encouraging words, NU. Thank you for posting. |
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................................  ................................ = Panama pfRedd - 2021 Regular Season Champion = ...............................  ................................
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Post by Walter on Oct 30, 2022 23:55:14 GMT -5
All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The church is not a place where perfect people gather. It is a place where spiritually sick people come together for healing. There will always be wolves in sheeps clothing, or hypocrites in the church. That there are hypocrites in the church is no defense before God to not believe. The wheat and weeds grow together until the end when.God sorts them out. It is not the hypocrites in the church that makes the sinner and the willful unbeliever uncomfortable in their ways where they lash out with persecution. It is the real thing, the genuine believer who does that. Inspiring and encouraging words, NU. Thank you for posting. The problem with his words is when instead of spiritual healing, those inside the church use the opportunity to teach MORE evil and spread MORE sickness. What then? |
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Post by Panama pfRedd on Oct 31, 2022 7:50:29 GMT -5
Inspiring and encouraging words, NU. Thank you for posting. The problem with his words is when instead of spiritual healing, those inside the church use the opportunity to teach MORE evil and spread MORE sickness. What then? You're sick. Get help dude. |
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Post by Walter on Oct 31, 2022 9:08:17 GMT -5
The problem with his words is when instead of spiritual healing, those inside the church use the opportunity to teach MORE evil and spread MORE sickness. What then? You're sick. Get help dude. Non-answer noted, Screwtape. |
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