What The Doctors Saw

[canefan]

I never have bought into the Warren Commission single shooter explanation, but when I was much younger I wasn't really able to grasp that our own government would lie to us or, even could have been involved in the assassination. Be interesting to see what the folks here think about this.


www.cbsnews.com/news/jfk-assassination-john-f-kennedy-doctors/



U.S.
JFK's E.R. doctors share new assassination details

Jacquelynn Lueth is executive producer of the new Paramount+ Original documentary, "JFK: What the Doctors Saw," which brings to light stunning revelations from doctors who were in the E.R. on the day of President John F. Kennedy's assassination. Stream it now on Paramount+.

November 22, 1963, is a date defined by I will never forget. Sent home from school alone, frightened and attached to the TV, the day unfolded before me that even by today's standards was too much, too fast and too sad to grasp the entirety of what went down.

My commitment to understanding it moved from passive to active many years later when Dr. Lawrence Klein, one of my personal physicians introduced to me by by mom, told me that on Nov. 22, 1963, he was a third-year medical student at UT Southwestern, doing a rotation at Parkland Memorial Hospital, and was in the emergency room when President John F. Kennedy was brought in. His hope was that his recollection, a shared moment in history, could be recorded as part of his legacy for his grandchildren.

At first, we talked about his role, taking the president into Trauma Room One, alerting the chief of neurosurgery, and wheeling wounded Texas Governor John Connolly on what would become the "magic bullet" gurney. As my background is in television, our talk quickly moved from an idea for a book to a documentary and a plan to contact the other surviving doctors who were in the ER that day. At that point, I had no preconceived perceptions or theories. With the luxury of more than 50 years of data and testimony, my research I began in the present and I worked my way backwards.

I videotaped interviews with seven of the doctors. We reached out to Dr. Malcom Perry, the attending surgeon in charge, and Dr. Kemp Clark, the chief of neurosurgery, but due to health issues neither was able to participate. The interviews were conducted individually and then I brought them together as a group. It was the first time since the day of the assassination that they had been reunited.

Their recollections were precise and clear, as if the intervening decades had melted away. Each of them reacted strongly when the autopsy pictures were projected on a screen. They didn't agree on everything, but it became obvious that the way the president looked at Parkland did not match the autopsy photos taken at Bethesda even before the official autopsy began.

Besides the doctors, I did several other interviews. Among these were Jim Jenkins, the only surviving member of the autopsy team, whose observations I wanted to compare with those of the Parkland doctors, and also Robert Tanenbaum, the original deputy chief counsel for the House Select Committee on Assassinations, who helped clarify what was told and not told to the public. He quit the committee because he felt they weren't conducting a real search for truth.

My husband, Bill Garnet, and I have continued our research for over 15 years, which has led us to the following conclusions: The doctors at Parkland had extensive experience in treating gunshot wounds and had no agenda other than trying to save the president's life. Those who saw the wound in the president's neck believed it was an entrance wound. Several of them saw a gaping hole in the back of JFK's head.

The government did everything it could do to negate, intimidate and threaten the Parkland doctors because their observations contradicted the single "magic bullet" theory of the Warren Commission. Based on this, I concluded that there had been a cover-up and the public had not been told the truth.

[Buckeye Dale]

coming up on 'that time' here in the next 20 minutes or so...hard to believe it's been 60 years.

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 13:13:09 GMT -5 Buckeye Dale said:

coming up on 'that time' here in the next 20 minutes or so...hard to believe it's been 60 years.

Damn sure is.....60 years flew by. And then 2 days later we all watched LHO get shot on live TV.

[Buckeye Dale]

Nov 22, 2023 13:40:43 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 13:13:09 GMT -5 Buckeye Dale said:

coming up on 'that time' here in the next 20 minutes or so...hard to believe it's been 60 years.

Damn sure is.....60 years flew by. And then 2 days later we all watched LHO get shot on live TV.

Yeah, I remember that...my mother made us watch TV thru the whole thing...said we were watchin' history... don't know that I ever thanked her for that.

[DrSchadenfreude]

The Parkland ER docs (and nurses) also clearly described the occipital-parietal skull exit wound-- in which a large skull fragment was blasted backward behind the limo, striking one of the motorcycle cops.  (And Jackie climbed onto the back of the limo to retrieve JFK's brain fragments that were blown backwards by the frontal head shot.)

This posterior skull exit wound is also consistent with the violent backward motion of JFK's head during the fatal head shot from the Grassy Knoll-- clearly visible on the Zapruder film.

The CIA went to great lengths to cover up the obvious evidence that JFK was killed by a shot fired from the front (and right) of the limo.  They needed to promote the false narrative that Oswald was a lone assassin in the Texas School Book Depository.

Their old OSS asset, C.D. Jackson, immediately purchased the Z-film for Henry Luce's Life magazine, and locked up the film for years-- after publishing an altered sequence of stills in Life, to promote the false CIA narrative that JFK was shot from behind.

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 10:00:43 GMT -5 canefan said:

I never have bought into the Warren Commission single shooter explanation, but when I was much younger I wasn't really able to grasp that our own government would lie to us or, even could have been involved in the assassination. Be interesting to see what the folks here think about this.


www.cbsnews.com/news/jfk-assassination-john-f-kennedy-doctors/



U.S.
JFK's E.R. doctors share new assassination details

Jacquelynn Lueth is executive producer of the new Paramount+ Original documentary, "JFK: What the Doctors Saw," which brings to light stunning revelations from doctors who were in the E.R. on the day of President John F. Kennedy's assassination. Stream it now on Paramount+.

November 22, 1963, is a date defined by I will never forget. Sent home from school alone, frightened and attached to the TV, the day unfolded before me that even by today's standards was too much, too fast and too sad to grasp the entirety of what went down.

My commitment to understanding it moved from passive to active many years later when Dr. Lawrence Klein, one of my personal physicians introduced to me by by mom, told me that on Nov. 22, 1963, he was a third-year medical student at UT Southwestern, doing a rotation at Parkland Memorial Hospital, and was in the emergency room when President John F. Kennedy was brought in. His hope was that his recollection, a shared moment in history, could be recorded as part of his legacy for his grandchildren.

At first, we talked about his role, taking the president into Trauma Room One, alerting the chief of neurosurgery, and wheeling wounded Texas Governor John Connolly on what would become the "magic bullet" gurney. As my background is in television, our talk quickly moved from an idea for a book to a documentary and a plan to contact the other surviving doctors who were in the ER that day. At that point, I had no preconceived perceptions or theories. With the luxury of more than 50 years of data and testimony, my research I began in the present and I worked my way backwards.

I videotaped interviews with seven of the doctors. We reached out to Dr. Malcom Perry, the attending surgeon in charge, and Dr. Kemp Clark, the chief of neurosurgery, but due to health issues neither was able to participate. The interviews were conducted individually and then I brought them together as a group. It was the first time since the day of the assassination that they had been reunited.

Their recollections were precise and clear, as if the intervening decades had melted away. Each of them reacted strongly when the autopsy pictures were projected on a screen. They didn't agree on everything, but it became obvious that the way the president looked at Parkland did not match the autopsy photos taken at Bethesda even before the official autopsy began.

Besides the doctors, I did several other interviews. Among these were Jim Jenkins, the only surviving member of the autopsy team, whose observations I wanted to compare with those of the Parkland doctors, and also Robert Tanenbaum, the original deputy chief counsel for the House Select Committee on Assassinations, who helped clarify what was told and not told to the public. He quit the committee because he felt they weren't conducting a real search for truth.

My husband, Bill Garnet, and I have continued our research for over 15 years, which has led us to the following conclusions: The doctors at Parkland had extensive experience in treating gunshot wounds and had no agenda other than trying to save the president's life. Those who saw the wound in the president's neck believed it was an entrance wound. Several of them saw a gaping hole in the back of JFK's head.

The government did everything it could do to negate, intimidate and threaten the Parkland doctors because their observations contradicted the single "magic bullet" theory of the Warren Commission. Based on this, I concluded that there had been a cover-up and the public had not been told the truth.

Always been open to possibility of a second shooter, but have not seen anything that would prove it. That said, also never doubted the government knew more about the shooting than they let on.

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 14:07:00 GMT -5 Buckeye Dale said:

Nov 22, 2023 13:40:43 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Damn sure is.....60 years flew by. And then 2 days later we all watched LHO get shot on live TV.

Yeah, I remember that...my mother made us watch TV thru the whole thing...said we were watchin' history... don't know that I ever thanked her for that.

Nobody forced us, but as I recall my brothers and I were watching on purpose....hell, it had been announced and publicized when, where and how he was going to be transferred. Different time to be sure.

[canefan]

Nov 22, 2023 14:21:30 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 14:07:00 GMT -5 Buckeye Dale said:

Yeah, I remember that...my mother made us watch TV thru the whole thing...said we were watchin' history... don't know that I ever thanked her for that.

Nobody forced us, but as I recall my brothers and I were watching on purpose....hell, it had been announced and publicized when, where and how he was going to be transferred. Different time to be sure.

Yep, we came in from lunch on the day JFK was shot and the teachers pulled all the classes together and put a tv on a stand in front of us all just in time to see Cronkite announce that JFK was dead. We all then waited for someone to come pick us up. No more school that day. Then, a few days later I was watching while the folks were outside putting up Christmas decorations when Oswald was shot on live tv.

If you watch the documentary, those docs were told by the CIA to never say they saw an entry wound in the front.

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 15:54:16 GMT -5 canefan said:

Nov 22, 2023 14:21:30 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nobody forced us, but as I recall my brothers and I were watching on purpose....hell, it had been announced and publicized when, where and how he was going to be transferred. Different time to be sure.

Yep, we came in from lunch on the day JFK was shot and the teachers pulled all the classes together and put a tv on a stand in front of us all just in time to see Cronkite announce that JFK was dead. We all then waited for someone to come pick us up. No more school that day. Then, a few days later I was watching while the folks were outside putting up Christmas decorations when Oswald was shot on live tv.

If you watch the documentary, those docs were told by the CIA to never say they saw an entry wound in the front.

I'll watch it at some point. I'm not doubting what the doctors say.....they were there, I wasn't. But, am saying I still have not seen evidence of a shot from the front. Starting with nobody saw anyone with a gun, nobody saw anyone leave the scene, nobody saw a muzzle flash. And if he was shot from the front, examine that theory under the same type of scrutiny as with the official version. Get into bullet trajectories and such. And then we'll still have questions.

[DrSchadenfreude]

Nov 22, 2023 14:21:30 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 14:07:00 GMT -5 Buckeye Dale said:

Yeah, I remember that...my mother made us watch TV thru the whole thing...said we were watchin' history... don't know that I ever thanked her for that.

Nobody forced us, but as I recall my brothers and I were watching on purpose....hell, it had been announced and publicized when, where and how he was going to be transferred. Different time to be sure.

Huh?

How about Newtonian physics?

Ever been to Dealey Plaza?

Explain how a shot fired from the Texas School Book Depository (behind the limo) could have knocked JFK's head violently backward- as seen clearly in the Zapruder film--while blasting the large occipital skull fragment and brain matter backward behind the limo.

Good luck.

(Hint: the CIA's Luis Alvarez cellophane-wrapped melon hypothesis has been thoroughly debunked.  A cellophane-wrapped melon is not even a remotely accurate simulation of a human skull.)

[canefan]

Nov 22, 2023 16:31:54 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 15:54:16 GMT -5 canefan said:

Yep, we came in from lunch on the day JFK was shot and the teachers pulled all the classes together and put a tv on a stand in front of us all just in time to see Cronkite announce that JFK was dead. We all then waited for someone to come pick us up. No more school that day. Then, a few days later I was watching while the folks were outside putting up Christmas decorations when Oswald was shot on live tv.

If you watch the documentary, those docs were told by the CIA to never say they saw an entry wound in the front.

I'll watch it at some point. I'm not doubting what the doctors say.....they were there, I wasn't. But, am saying I still have not seen evidence of a shot from the front. Starting with nobody saw anyone with a gun, nobody saw anyone leave the scene, nobody saw a muzzle flash. And if he was shot from the front, examine that theory under the same type of scrutiny as with the official version. Get into bullet trajectories and such. And then we'll still have questions.

Well, evidently there were multiple people who said it was an entry wound in front and an exit wound in back. As noted before, the lead doc was told never say it was a front entrance wound again, if you know what's good for you. And there were multiple witnesses who say they saw a shooter behind the fence on the grassy knoll. And nobody has ever explained how the chunk of his brain wound up on the trunk deck with a shot from the back. To me there is no doubt we've been lied to for decades.

[DrSchadenfreude]

Nov 22, 2023 16:31:54 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 15:54:16 GMT -5 canefan said:

Yep, we came in from lunch on the day JFK was shot and the teachers pulled all the classes together and put a tv on a stand in front of us all just in time to see Cronkite announce that JFK was dead. We all then waited for someone to come pick us up. No more school that day. Then, a few days later I was watching while the folks were outside putting up Christmas decorations when Oswald was shot on live tv.

If you watch the documentary, those docs were told by the CIA to never say they saw an entry wound in the front.

I'll watch it at some point. I'm not doubting what the doctors say.....they were there, I wasn't. But, am saying I still have not seen evidence of a shot from the front. Starting with nobody saw anyone with a gun, nobody saw anyone leave the scene, nobody saw a muzzle flash. And if he was shot from the front, examine that theory under the same type of scrutiny as with the official version. Get into bullet trajectories and such. And then we'll still have questions.

This statement by Harry includes numerous false statements.

The FBI's own ballistics tests debunked the official Warren Commission narrative.  For example, a Carcano test shot fired from the 6th floor of the TSBD blew off the right half of a cadaver face in JFK's limo position.   In contrast the actual kill shot (fired from in front of the limo) blew off the back of JFK's skull, knocking his head violently backward.

Also, multiple witnesses in and around Dealey Plaza heard gun shots and/or saw smoke from the picket fence next to the pavilion on the Grassy Knoll.  Lee Bowers also saw men in the parking lot behind the fence before the motorcade arrived in Dealey Plaza.

A great deal of critical witness testimony was carefully omitted by the FBI (and Hoover) from the Warren Commission.

Hoover rapidly shut down a genuine FBI investigation of JFK's murder-- after the CIA patsy, Oswald, was quickly arrested-- and collaborated with LBJ, Allen Dulles and WC to omit evidence debunking the WCR's Lone Assassin narrative.

The Secret Service also illegal confiscated JFK's body from the Parkland coroner-- in violation of Texas law-- for the LBJ regime's sham autopsy at Bethesda.

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 17:57:07 GMT -5 DrSchadenfreude said:

Nov 22, 2023 14:21:30 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nobody forced us, but as I recall my brothers and I were watching on purpose....hell, it had been announced and publicized when, where and how he was going to be transferred. Different time to be sure.

Huh?
How about Newtonian physics? Okay. www.cell.com/heliyon/fulltext/S2405-8440(17)33188-2

Ever been to Dealey Plaza? Yep. You?

Explain how a shot fired from the Texas School Book Depository (behind the limo) could have knocked JFK's head violently backward- as seen clearly in the Zapruder film--while blasting the large occipital skull fragment and brain matter backward behind the limo. See link above.

Good luck.  

(Hint: the CIA's Luis Alvarez cellophane-wrapped melon hypothesis has been thoroughly debunked.  A cellophane-wrapped melon is not even a remotely accurate simulation of a human skull.) I never made that claim. 

[oujour76]

Nov 22, 2023 21:51:17 GMT -5 canefan said:

Nov 22, 2023 16:31:54 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

I'll watch it at some point. I'm not doubting what the doctors say.....they were there, I wasn't. But, am saying I still have not seen evidence of a shot from the front. Starting with nobody saw anyone with a gun, nobody saw anyone leave the scene, nobody saw a muzzle flash. And if he was shot from the front, examine that theory under the same type of scrutiny as with the official version. Get into bullet trajectories and such. And then we'll still have questions.

Well, evidently there were multiple people who said it was an entry wound in front and an exit wound in back. As noted before, the lead doc was told never say it was a front entrance wound again, if you know what's good for you. And there were multiple witnesses who say they saw a shooter behind the fence on the grassy knoll. And nobody has ever explained how the chunk of his brain wound up on the trunk deck with a shot from the back. To me there is no doubt we've been lied to for decades.

Still raises questions. If he was shot from the front, at a downward arc, and with entry wound in the throat and exit wound in the back.....what happened to that bullet? As for witnesses seeing a grassy knoll shooter....where is the physical evidence? Shell casings? And how did this shooter disappear carrying a gun in broad daylight? When there were lots of people around the entire area? That's just for starters. If he was also hit in the head, that's two shots. So, where did the shot that hit Connally come from? And where is that bullet?

As for part of the brain being found behind the car, it has been explained and I posted a link earlier.....here it is. Obviously, you're free to agree or disagree with the findings. www.cell.com/heliyon/fulltext/S2405-8440(17)33188-2.

Here is a link on the acoustics and shock that day at Dealey Plaza, and how people could legitimately be confused on the origin of gunshots. Also, the how and why people in the same area could come to different conclusions. www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2021.763432/full. Read it if you have the time or inclination. As food for thought, posted below is something in the report that I found very interesting:

"We are convinced that had any rifle shots actually originated from the knoll area on the day of the assassination, the earwitnesses from that vicinity would have shown high confidence and high agreement about that fact. The fence on the grassy knoll was only a few meters to the right of the amateur photographer, A. Zapruder. Had a rifle shot actually originated from the grassy knoll, his startle response might well have knocked him sideways, off his perch on the pergola."

[canefan]

Nov 23, 2023 1:04:41 GMT -5 oujour76 said:

Nov 22, 2023 21:51:17 GMT -5 canefan said:

Well, evidently there were multiple people who said it was an entry wound in front and an exit wound in back. As noted before, the lead doc was told never say it was a front entrance wound again, if you know what's good for you. And there were multiple witnesses who say they saw a shooter behind the fence on the grassy knoll. And nobody has ever explained how the chunk of his brain wound up on the trunk deck with a shot from the back. To me there is no doubt we've been lied to for decades.

Still raises questions. If he was shot from the front, at a downward arc, and with entry wound in the throat and exit wound in the back.....what happened to that bullet? As for witnesses seeing a grassy knoll shooter....where is the physical evidence? Shell casings? And how did this shooter disappear carrying a gun in broad daylight? When there were lots of people around the entire area? That's just for starters. If he was also hit in the head, that's two shots. So, where did the shot that hit Connally come from? And where is that bullet?

As for part of the brain being found behind the car, it has been explained and I posted a link earlier.....here it is. Obviously, you're free to agree or disagree with the findings. www.cell.com/heliyon/fulltext/S2405-8440(17)33188-2.

Here is a link on the acoustics and shock that day at Dealey Plaza, and how people could legitimately be confused on the origin of gunshots. Also, the how and why people in the same area could come to different conclusions. www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2021.763432/full. Read it if you have the time or inclination. As food for thought, posted below is something in the report that I found very interesting:

"We are convinced that had any rifle shots actually originated from the knoll area on the day of the assassination, the earwitnesses from that vicinity would have shown high confidence and high agreement about that fact. The fence on the grassy knoll was only a few meters to the right of the amateur photographer, A. Zapruder. Had a rifle shot actually originated from the grassy knoll, his startle response might well have knocked him sideways, off his perch on the pergola."

I honestly believe much of what you note is part of the cover-up. There were a number of folks who reported seeing a shooter, seeing the smoke, etc. and they were pretty much ignored. If you watch the film you will see that they did discover a small (think entry wound) on the right side of his head, in front of the ear along the hair line that was easily missed.This was likely the entry wound for the bullet that exited through the occipital area. They also interviewed the autopsy technician who assisted at the government autopsy in DC. He confirmed the entry wound in front of the ear on the right side as well as the fact they removed his brain before the autopsy and took out all fragment of the shell. Then the docs doing the autopsy questioned had the brain been operated on. When they did this it destroyed any evidence available to figure out the track of the projectile. And why didn't they use forensic pathologists for the autopsy. Its the president of the US and they have two senior pathologists with no experience in gunshot wounds do the procedure? And finally, its been 60 years. Very few if any of those involved are still alive. Why continue to hold back so much information on the assassination They arent protecting anyone, they are protecting their agency.