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Post by mscott59 on Sept 8, 2013 21:55:13 GMT -5
Fair or not, Paterno was the public face of Penn State. And the media had spent the last umpteen years telling us how "JoePa" was in charge and Penn State was a shining example of how college athletics should be run and on and on and on. So, when the school is found to have had a child predator on its hands for 20 years or so the obvious question was...where the hell was JoePa? So, of course the media focused on Joe Paterno. Why would anyone expect otherwise? That is what the media does.
One other aspect here. Sandusky may have been an "ex-employee", but he was allowed to have an office on campus at the athletic complex and freedom to roam the athletic facilities there. And I don't know who would be surprised at the notion that attorneys were strongly influencing decisions made by university officials in the wake of all this. Of course they were, and are. The financial and reputation risks remain exponential there. And, at least from the outside, it remains to appear that many are working hard, really hard, to prove that, while Paterno was always positioned as being omnipotent when it came to his program, it wasnt true when it related to Sandusky. It makes it seem that joepa's image is more important than any other aspect of this horrible series of events. IMHO that's not good. Mark Scott Tosu 81 iPads capitalize. Dammit |
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 9, 2013 8:10:53 GMT -5
Fair or not, Paterno was the public face of Penn State. And the media had spent the last umpteen years telling us how "JoePa" was in charge and Penn State was a shining example of how college athletics should be run and on and on and on. So, when the school is found to have had a child predator on its hands for 20 years or so the obvious question was...where the hell was JoePa? So, of course the media focused on Joe Paterno. Why would anyone expect otherwise? That is what the media does.
i am not shocked that the media focused on paterno...i am shocked that paterno wasn't given the benefit of the doubt considering the lack of evidence against him. there is such a huge difference between flawed judgment and malicious cover up. |
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 9, 2013 9:27:21 GMT -5
One other aspect here. Sandusky may have been an "ex-employee", but he was allowed to have an office on campus at the athletic complex and freedom to roam the athletic facilities there. And I don't know who would be surprised at the notion that attorneys were strongly influencing decisions made by university officials in the wake of all this. Of course they were, and are. The financial and reputation risks remain exponential there. And, at least from the outside, it remains to appear that many are working hard, really hard, to prove that, while Paterno was always positioned as being omnipotent when it came to his program, it wasnt true when it related to Sandusky. It makes it seem that joepa's image is more important than any other aspect of this horrible series of events. IMHO that's not good. Mark Scott Tosu 81 iPads capitalize. Dammit fwiw, nearly everyone involved in this scandal has put their image ahead of everything else, including the ncaa and louis freeh. paterno wasn't omnipotent. he was fired via telephone after the board of trustees met and decided to terminate him. you can't be all powerful but then fired against your will. that doesn't make sense. in hindsight, everyone, including paterno should have done more. but the fact that he became the face of this whole thing is disgraceful considering he was never criminally accused of any wrong doing. it's disgraceful because he had a 61 year career in a sport swimming with vicious sharks w/ barely any ethical blemishes yet he became the scapegoat for all these evil reprehensible crimes. |
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Post by mscott59 on Sept 9, 2013 9:47:13 GMT -5
fwiw, nearly everyone involved in this scandal has put their image ahead of everything else, including the ncaa and louis freeh. paterno wasn't omnipotent. he was fired via telephone after the board of trustees met and decided to terminate him. you can't be all powerful but then fired against your will. that doesn't make sense. in hindsight, everyone, including paterno should have done more. but the fact that he became the face of this whole thing is disgraceful considering he was never criminally accused of any wrong doing. it's disgraceful because he had a 61 year career in a sport swimming with vicious sharks w/ barely any ethical blemishes yet he became the scapegoat for all these evil reprehensible crimes. who on the planet thinks paterno became the face of this scandal?  i don't. i don't think any critic does. that is where i have the biggest issue... the pro-paterno crowd, for lack of a better term, is seeing a mirage. joe isn't, and wasn't, the 'face' of this scandal. he was one of the players though. a player who, along with all the other administrators involved, had the authority to do more than they did to keep children out of harm's way. there are many many faces in this. beginning w/Sandusky's, and his victims. mark scott tosu 81 |
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 9, 2013 10:41:38 GMT -5
who on the planet thinks paterno became the face of this scandal? i don't. i don't think any critic does. that is where i have the biggest issue... the pro-paterno crowd, for lack of a better term, is seeing a mirage. joe isn't, and wasn't, the 'face' of this scandal. he was one of the players though. a player who, along with all the other administrators involved, had the authority to do more than they did to keep children out of harm's way. there are many many faces in this. beginning w/Sandusky's, and his victims. mark scott tosu 81
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 9, 2013 16:06:24 GMT -5
who on the planet thinks paterno became the face of this scandal? i don't. i don't think any critic does. that is where i have the biggest issue... the pro-paterno crowd, for lack of a better term, is seeing a mirage. joe isn't, and wasn't, the 'face' of this scandal. he was one of the players though. a player who, along with all the other administrators involved, had the authority to do more than they did to keep children out of harm's way. there are many many faces in this. beginning w/Sandusky's, and his victims. mark scott tosu 81 the ncaa also made this about paterno/football because the punishment of penn state by the ncaa was a direct result of paterno's involvement. the consent decree even mentions paterno's name specifically. there are a lot of layers to this scandal. but, there is absolutely no doubt that paterno's role in everything was what drew the most intense media interest. feel free to disagree, but the beef that the pro paterno crowd has is that the amount of blame given to paterno was unfair. |
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 9, 2013 20:01:50 GMT -5
the ncaa also made this about paterno/football because the punishment of penn state by the ncaa was a direct result of paterno's involvement. the consent decree even mentions paterno's name specifically. there are a lot of layers to this scandal. but, there is absolutely no doubt that paterno's role in everything was what drew the most intense media interest. feel free to disagree, but the beef that the pro paterno crowd has is that the amount of blame given to paterno was unfair. |
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Post by daleko on Sept 9, 2013 23:07:53 GMT -5
Of course the consent decree mentions Paterno, it would be shocking if he weren't. He was the head coach when all of this stuff went down. Why wouldn't he be mentioned? You're trying to make it sound as if the bulk of the blame was placed on Paterno and that simply isn't the case. It does link Paterno with to Schultz, Spanier and Curley but it assigns much more of the blame to those 3. For anybody who cares here is the consent decree. s3.amazonaws.com/ncaa/files/20120723/21207236PDF.pdf |
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 9, 2013 23:39:16 GMT -5
Part of the bigger PR strategy by the PSU faithful, lead here by IHS, is to recover Paterno's lost victories and put him back at #1. It's a point of pride for IHS, a large part of his PSU life. Though understandable, I could care less. Paterno could have and should have put an end to this whole thing a long time ago. IHS convinced me long ago that Paterno had too many deep pocket PSU supporters in his corner that prevented PSU from working out a deal when PSU had those several "bad" years. Those supporters ran for the hills when faced with kids getting raped in PSU shower under Paterno's watch and allowed him to get tanked. Until then he controlled the roost.
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Post by mscott59 on Sept 10, 2013 8:31:51 GMT -5
As I have said several times I think Penn State crapped on Paterno worse than the media or even the NCAA. That said, I do get that the PSU faithful want those victories restored...and on that point, I agree with them. IMO vacating those wins was just the NCAA's way of distancing themselves from someone they had put on a pedestal for many, many years. I agree that Paterno ran the roost there for a long, long time. IMO and as I've said previously Paterno's sins were those of omission, not commission.
it's a lot easier to aim your venom at the evil out of touch ncaa than your own family within state college. the ncaa did not fire paterno. they didn't let him go with a phone call. vacating wins has always been an empty penalty, and everyone knows how successful paterno was at psu so in my mind his legacy is not damaged by that. but in varying degrees everyone looked the other way for way too long on this... and it did not go away. mark scott tosu 81 |
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Post by mscott59 on Sept 10, 2013 8:37:15 GMT -5
Of course the consent decree mentions Paterno, it would be shocking if he weren't. He was the head coach when all of this stuff went down. Why wouldn't he be mentioned? You're trying to make it sound as if the bulk of the blame was placed on Paterno and that simply isn't the case. It does link Paterno with to Schultz, Spanier and Curley but it assigns much more of the blame to those 3. For anybody who cares here is the consent decree. s3.amazonaws.com/ncaa/files/20120723/21207236PDF.pdf thanks for posting the link, harry. as for the link to the football program... didn't Sandusky still have an office inside the football complex? we all know this was undiscovered waters in terms of what the ncaa AND psu chose to do in response to this. but psu put their signature on the punishment. if school leaders didn't feel it was warranted, then they should not have agreed to it and should have fought the ncaa in court, if that's what it have gone to in order to resolve it. mark scott tosu 81 |
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 10, 2013 9:30:37 GMT -5
Of course the consent decree mentions Paterno, it would be shocking if he weren't. He was the head coach when all of this stuff went down. Why wouldn't he be mentioned? You're trying to make it sound as if the bulk of the blame was placed on Paterno and that simply isn't the case. It does link Paterno with to Schultz, Spanier and Curley but it assigns much more of the blame to those 3. For anybody who cares here is the consent decree. s3.amazonaws.com/ncaa/files/20120723/21207236PDF.pdf The Freeh report concludes that paterno and other high ranking officials "repeatedly concealed critical facts relating to Sandusky’s child abuse." Do you agree or disagree with this statement? |
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 10, 2013 9:32:43 GMT -5
Part of the bigger PR strategy by the PSU faithful, lead here by IHS, is to recover Paterno's lost victories and put him back at #1. It's a point of pride for IHS, a large part of his PSU life. Though understandable, I could care less. Paterno could have and should have put an end to this whole thing a long time ago. IHS convinced me long ago that Paterno had too many deep pocket PSU supporters in his corner that prevented PSU from working out a deal when PSU had those several "bad" years. Those supporters ran for the hills when faced with kids getting raped in PSU shower under Paterno's watch and allowed him to get tanked. Until then he controlled the roost. Not one kid was raped in a PSU shower, let alone multiple kids. Not only was Sandusky found innocent on that charge in his trial, the victim himself stated he was not abused that night. That's the reason the prosecution never asked him to testify. |
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 10, 2013 9:36:35 GMT -5
thanks for posting the link, harry. as for the link to the football program... didn't Sandusky still have an office inside the football complex? we all know this was undiscovered waters in terms of what the ncaa AND psu chose to do in response to this. but psu put their signature on the punishment. if school leaders didn't feel it was warranted, then they should not have agreed to it and should have fought the ncaa in court, if that's what it have gone to in order to resolve it. mark scott tosu 81 psu was coerced into that agreement with the threat of the multi year suspension of its football program. with the public sentiment at the time, it was the only way they thought they could live to see another day. it was still a giant mistake not to fight it. |
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Post by daleko on Sept 10, 2013 10:57:25 GMT -5
Not one kid was raped in a PSU shower, let alone multiple kids. Not only was Sandusky found innocent on that charge in his trial, the victim himself stated he was not abused that night. That's the reason the prosecution never asked him to testify.
IHS, you want to comment that the NCAA had no jurisdiction, that the penalty was too severe? Have at it. But spare me the no one knew defense. That he was real sneaky bringing little boys on PSu road trips, sharing a hotel room, bringing them on campus and taking naked showers with them for what was probably 20 yrs. They knew or should have known what was happening wasn't, at the very least, appropriate and that they could have and should have done something to put an end to it long before it became "front page". And "they" includes JP, imo. He had the support, the position and the power to end it. Define it as omission or commission, matters not to me. Had they stopped the inappropriate early, maybe this never becomes a larger PSu issue. |
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i don't. i don't think any critic does. that is where i have the biggest issue... the pro-paterno crowd, for lack of a better term, is seeing a mirage. joe isn't, and wasn't, the 'face' of this scandal. he was one of the players though. a player who, along with all the other administrators involved, had the authority to do more than they did to keep children out of harm's way. there are many many faces in this. beginning w/Sandusky's, and his victims.
