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Post by beuycek on Sept 4, 2013 9:39:15 GMT -5
From an unlikely source, too... one of the prosecutors in the Sandusky case. onwardstate.com/2013/09/04/sandusky-prosecutor-to-cbs-no-evidence-paterno-participated-in-coverup/Makes Emmert's spiteful decision to strike the wins all the more ridiculous. Interesting, too as it relates to the others still to have their cases heard, that the prosecutor thinks they actively participated (and continue to do so) in covering up what they knew. The trials will certainly be worth paying attention to.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 4, 2013 15:52:29 GMT -5
From an unlikely source, too... one of the prosecutors in the Sandusky case. onwardstate.com/2013/09/04/sandusky-prosecutor-to-cbs-no-evidence-paterno-participated-in-coverup/Makes Emmert's spiteful decision to strike the wins all the more ridiculous. Interesting, too as it relates to the others still to have their cases heard, that the prosecutor thinks they actively participated (and continue to do so) in covering up what they knew. The trials will certainly be worth paying attention to. saw this last nite...wasn't going to post it b/c I figured it's college football season and Michigan/notre dame is far more interesting than this stuff butttt since it was posted, I will chime in.. like you said, this makes the ncaa's decision to hammer penn state look even dumber. not only is there no evidence that paterno covered up Sandusky's crimes, but it is factual that paterno never instructed anyone not to talk, he never obstructed any investigation in anyway and any details from what mcqueary told him were immediately passed on to the university president, university athletic director and the administrative head of the campus police. the attorney general's office initially praised paterno for his honesty in testifying. paterno wasn't vilified in his role until the psu bot began handling everything. they threw him under a bus to protect themselves. if the psu bot and the ncaa continue to rely on a report that looks dumber each and every day, they are only going to look worse in their handling of everything.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 6, 2013 11:38:39 GMT -5
From an unlikely source, too... one of the prosecutors in the Sandusky case. onwardstate.com/2013/09/04/sandusky-prosecutor-to-cbs-no-evidence-paterno-participated-in-coverup/Makes Emmert's spiteful decision to strike the wins all the more ridiculous. Interesting, too as it relates to the others still to have their cases heard, that the prosecutor thinks they actively participated (and continue to do so) in covering up what they knew. The trials will certainly be worth paying attention to. A few more things about this interview which was aired the other night... 1. Spanier/Schultz/Curley tried to get it banned from airing b/c they said it was prejudicial to their case 2. as noted by ivan maisal of espn, the only person w/ subpoena power in this whole scandal is saying paterno is innocent of any criminal activity 3. it seems the narrative has shifted from paterno maliciously concealing the actions of a child rapist to paterno not doing more when told of a vague allegation of someone possibly hearing sexual abuse. at this point, rather than concede that freeh's conclusions were wrong(and consequently the ncca's punishment), media types like keyteyian play the "but he ran the university card." and they do this w/o at least acknowledging that paterno did not witness the crime, mcqueary stated he was satisfied with the univ's initial response, paterno's did not instruct anyone in anyway to lie or not talk, paterno testified honestly to the grand jury even though his testimony damaged his own reputation. 4. to this day, louis freeh has not followed up on his promise to engaged the students, faculty and alumni of penn state as he promised to do in his report. he gave his press conference immediately after releasing his report to the public which meant no one was able to actually read his report because they could ask him any questions. he has not spoken publically commented on those who dispute his findings. he took the money psu foolishly paid him and then ran.
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 6, 2013 14:38:05 GMT -5
From an unlikely source, too... one of the prosecutors in the Sandusky case. onwardstate.com/2013/09/04/sandusky-prosecutor-to-cbs-no-evidence-paterno-participated-in-coverup/Makes Emmert's spiteful decision to strike the wins all the more ridiculous. Interesting, too as it relates to the others still to have their cases heard, that the prosecutor thinks they actively participated (and continue to do so) in covering up what they knew. The trials will certainly be worth paying attention to. A few more things about this interview which was aired the other night... 1. Spanier/Schultz/Curley tried to get it banned from airing b/c they said it was prejudicial to their case 2. as noted by ivan maisal of espn, the only person w/ subpoena power in this whole scandal is saying paterno is innocent of any criminal activity 3. it seems the narrative has shifted from paterno maliciously concealing the actions of a child rapist to paterno not doing more when told of a vague allegation of someone possibly hearing sexual abuse. at this point, rather than concede that freeh's conclusions were wrong(and consequently the ncca's punishment), media types like keyteyian play the "but he ran the university card." and they do this w/o at least acknowledging that paterno did not witness the crime, mcqueary stated he was satisfied with the univ's initial response, paterno's did not instruct anyone in anyway to lie or not talk, paterno testified honestly to the grand jury even though his testimony damaged his own reputation. 4. to this day, louis freeh has not followed up on his promise to engaged the students, faculty and alumni of penn state as he promised to do in his report. he gave his press conference immediately after releasing his report to the public which meant no one was able to actually read his report because they could ask him any questions. he has not spoken publically commented on those who dispute his findings. he took the money psu foolishly paid him and then ran. I don't recall many, if any, claiming there was enough evidence to convict Joe Paterno of a crime. He was the coach at Penn State for 45 years and his entire "paper trail" is virtually non-existent. But, being not guilty is wholly different from being innocent.
The lack of a paper trail means that people will believe what they wish to believe about Paterno. I believe he would be found "not guilty" in a courtroom, but that a far cry from being innocent.
I think he knew that Sandusky was bad news but chose to look the other way. That said, I don't believe he knew the extent of just how sick and twisted Sandusky really was. And I believe he regretted his inaction terribly in the last year of his life. I think guilt killed him as much as his cancer.
You believe Paterno is both "not guilty" and innocent...further that he is the victim of a witch hunt who knew nothing and suspected nothing about Sandusky.
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 6, 2013 14:53:51 GMT -5
A few more things about this interview which was aired the other night... 1. Spanier/Schultz/Curley tried to get it banned from airing b/c they said it was prejudicial to their case 2. as noted by ivan maisal of espn, the only person w/ subpoena power in this whole scandal is saying paterno is innocent of any criminal activity 3. it seems the narrative has shifted from paterno maliciously concealing the actions of a child rapist to paterno not doing more when told of a vague allegation of someone possibly hearing sexual abuse. at this point, rather than concede that freeh's conclusions were wrong(and consequently the ncca's punishment), media types like keyteyian play the "but he ran the university card." and they do this w/o at least acknowledging that paterno did not witness the crime, mcqueary stated he was satisfied with the univ's initial response, paterno's did not instruct anyone in anyway to lie or not talk, paterno testified honestly to the grand jury even though his testimony damaged his own reputation. 4. to this day, louis freeh has not followed up on his promise to engaged the students, faculty and alumni of penn state as he promised to do in his report. he gave his press conference immediately after releasing his report to the public which meant no one was able to actually read his report because they could ask him any questions. he has not spoken publically commented on those who dispute his findings. he took the money psu foolishly paid him and then ran. I don't recall many, if any, claiming there was enough evidence to convict Joe Paterno of a crime. He was the coach at Penn State for 45 years and his entire "paper trail" is virtually non-existent. But, being not guilty is wholly different from being innocent.
The lack of a paper trail means that people will believe what they wish to believe about Paterno. I believe he would be found "not guilty" in a courtroom, but that a far cry from being innocent.
I think he knew that Sandusky was bad news but chose to look the other way. That said, I don't believe he knew the extent of just how sick and twisted Sandusky really was. And I believe he regretted his inaction terribly in the last year of his life. I think guilt killed him as much as his cancer.
You believe Paterno is both "not guilty" and innocent...further that he is the victim of a witch hunt who knew nothing and suspected nothing about Sandusky.
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. this is an entirely different argument. people are going to believe what they are going to believe. the full extent of paterno's knowledge of what sandusky was will be never be known and his legacy is rightly forever tarnished. freeh wrote a report. his conclusions were shocking. he accused paterno of knowingly concealing the actions of a child rapist. the ncaa used this report in lieu of their own investigation to heavily punish penn state. by doing so, they validated freeh's findings. they responded very quickly after freeh released his report, giving the public zero time to weigh the merits of the freeh report. but it turns out the freeh report was wrong. there was no evidence that paterno acted criminally. it's not just me saying it. you now have the guy w/ subpoena power who investigated Sandusky saying the same thing. and freeh refuses to respond back to any dispute or criticism of his findings. he has refused every interview request. he has refused to speak with penn state students even though he promised he would. he refused to speak publically in any capacity about his finding after his press conference in which people only had time to read his conclusions and not the evidence used to back up his conclusions. the argument, as the original poster of this thread brought up, is why the hell emmert acted the way he did knowing all this.
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 6, 2013 15:39:36 GMT -5
this is an entirely different argument. people are going to believe what they are going to believe. the full extent of paterno's knowledge of what sandusky was will be never be known and his legacy is rightly forever tarnished. freeh wrote a report. his conclusions were shocking. he accused paterno of knowingly concealing the actions of a child rapist. the ncaa used this report in lieu of their own investigation to heavily punish penn state. by doing so, they validated freeh's findings. they responded very quickly after freeh released his report, giving the public zero time to weigh the merits of the freeh report. but it turns out the freeh report was wrong. there was no evidence that paterno acted criminally. it's not just me saying it. you now have the guy w/ subpoena power who investigated Sandusky saying the same thing. and freeh refuses to respond back to any dispute or criticism of his findings. he has refused every interview request. he has refused to speak with penn state students even though he promised he would. he refused to speak publically in any capacity about his finding after his press conference in which people only had time to read his conclusions and not the evidence used to back up his conclusions. the argument, as the original poster of this thread brought up, is why the hell emmert acted the way he did knowing all this. It's not a different argument from what I've been saying all along regarding Paterno. As far as Freeh goes, I've said since day one that he put together a report at the behest of the PSU Board of Trustees...they accepted it and allowed the NCAA to do what they did. It's not that I don't sympathize with PSU, but they signed on to this thing....the time to fight sanctions was then, not now....what they are trying to do is put the toothpaste back in the tube. And I'm not sure that is a wise move because no matter what happens with the sanctions it keeps Sandusky and PSU and child molestation front and center. That is a PR move you want to avoid.
If Spanier, Schultz and Curley get convicted it's even worse. Then PSU is left with..."our President, Vice President and A.D. knowingly let a child molester run loose, but by God, Joe Paterno knew nothing so we got that going for us." And nobody can really explain just why Paterno was so far in the dark. When the dust settles this is going to cost PSU $150 million or more. That's the bad news. The good news is PSU has the money. What's done is done...O'Brien has done a great job just moving ahead but the school itself sounds like a bunch of whiners. And just FTR, none of what I'm saying means I am endorsing Freeh or the NCAA.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 6, 2013 16:28:09 GMT -5
this is an entirely different argument. people are going to believe what they are going to believe. the full extent of paterno's knowledge of what sandusky was will be never be known and his legacy is rightly forever tarnished. freeh wrote a report. his conclusions were shocking. he accused paterno of knowingly concealing the actions of a child rapist. the ncaa used this report in lieu of their own investigation to heavily punish penn state. by doing so, they validated freeh's findings. they responded very quickly after freeh released his report, giving the public zero time to weigh the merits of the freeh report. but it turns out the freeh report was wrong. there was no evidence that paterno acted criminally. it's not just me saying it. you now have the guy w/ subpoena power who investigated Sandusky saying the same thing. and freeh refuses to respond back to any dispute or criticism of his findings. he has refused every interview request. he has refused to speak with penn state students even though he promised he would. he refused to speak publically in any capacity about his finding after his press conference in which people only had time to read his conclusions and not the evidence used to back up his conclusions. the argument, as the original poster of this thread brought up, is why the hell emmert acted the way he did knowing all this. It's not a different argument from what I've been saying all along regarding Paterno. As far as Freeh goes, I've said since day one that he put together a report at the behest of the PSU Board of Trustees...they accepted it and allowed the NCAA to do what they did. It's not that I don't sympathize with PSU, but they signed on to this thing....the time to fight sanctions was then, not now....what they are trying to do is put the toothpaste back in the tube. And I'm not sure that is a wise move because no matter what happens with the sanctions it keeps Sandusky and PSU and child molestation front and center. That is a PR move you want to avoid.
If Spanier, Schultz and Curley get convicted it's even worse. Then PSU is left with..."our President, Vice President and A.D. knowingly let a child molester run loose, but by God, Joe Paterno knew nothing so we got that going for us." And nobody can really explain just why Paterno was so far in the dark. When the dust settles this is going to cost PSU $150 million or more. That's the bad news. The good news is PSU has the money. What's done is done...O'Brien has done a great job just moving ahead but the school itself sounds like a bunch of whiners. And just FTR, none of what I'm saying means I am endorsing Freeh or the NCAA. fwiw, the board of trustees never accepted the freeh report. they commissioned it and they said they would use the recommendations in the report as a basis for making some changes. but they never voted on accepting the report. i know this doesn't really mean anything about they foolishly signed the consent decree. the university isn't fighting the sanctions...paterno/letterman/few members of the board as individuals are fighting the sanctions. i'm sure the university is working behind the scenes on a deal to get them reduced, but the people fighting back are people who had nothing to do with the toothpaste being out of the tube in the first place. the trials are key. that's obvious. even if the administrators are convicted, i still don't see how this is an ncaa issue. even if it is proven behind a reasonable doubt that the psu administrators conspired to keep Sandusky's crimes concealed (and that they have full knowledge of what he was), these actions have nothing to do with the ncaa's stated mission. and it will be near impossible to prove that their motivations were football based and not based on protecting the univ's relationship with the 2nd mile or some other university relationship that has nothing to do with the ncaa. i see why those believe that moving on is the best course of action for penn state. it makes sense. but, there are a lot of people who believe that a huge injustice was done to many innocent people. emmert's words really hurt. he blamed students, faculty, alumni, letterman, coaches, etc for facilitating a culture that allowed a pedophile to roam loose. that's hard to get over. and what was emmert's motivation for doing so? does he really believe penn state's culture was corrupt to the core or did he want to use this as an opportunity to change people's floundering perceptions of his organization?
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 6, 2013 17:31:57 GMT -5
fwiw, the board of trustees never accepted the freeh report. they commissioned it and they said they would use the recommendations in the report as a basis for making some changes. but they never voted on accepting the report. i know this doesn't really mean anything about they foolishly signed the consent decree. the university isn't fighting the sanctions...paterno/letterman/few members of the board as individuals are fighting the sanctions. i'm sure the university is working behind the scenes on a deal to get them reduced, but the people fighting back are people who had nothing to do with the toothpaste being out of the tube in the first place. the trials are key. that's obvious. even if the administrators are convicted, i still don't see how this is an ncaa issue. even if it is proven behind a reasonable doubt that the psu administrators conspired to keep Sandusky's crimes concealed (and that they have full knowledge of what he was), these actions have nothing to do with the ncaa's stated mission. and it will be near impossible to prove that their motivations were football based and not based on protecting the univ's relationship with the 2nd mile or some other university relationship that has nothing to do with the ncaa. i see why those believe that moving on is the best course of action for penn state. it makes sense. but, there are a lot of people who believe that a huge injustice was done to many innocent people. emmert's words really hurt. he blamed students, faculty, alumni, letterman, coaches, etc for facilitating a culture that allowed a pedophile to roam loose. that's hard to get over. and what was emmert's motivation for doing so? does he really believe penn state's culture was corrupt to the core or did he want to use this as an opportunity to change people's floundering perceptions of his organization? No clue as to Emmert's motivations. As for the 3 on trial..yes, it will be hard to prove that their motivation(s) were football related. But, let's be honest here...if Jerry Sandusky were a janitor in the Engineering Department do you think Spanier, etc. would have taken the same actions as they did with Jerry Sandusky the football coach?
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 6, 2013 18:59:27 GMT -5
fwiw, the board of trustees never accepted the freeh report. they commissioned it and they said they would use the recommendations in the report as a basis for making some changes. but they never voted on accepting the report. i know this doesn't really mean anything about they foolishly signed the consent decree. the university isn't fighting the sanctions...paterno/letterman/few members of the board as individuals are fighting the sanctions. i'm sure the university is working behind the scenes on a deal to get them reduced, but the people fighting back are people who had nothing to do with the toothpaste being out of the tube in the first place. the trials are key. that's obvious. even if the administrators are convicted, i still don't see how this is an ncaa issue. even if it is proven behind a reasonable doubt that the psu administrators conspired to keep Sandusky's crimes concealed (and that they have full knowledge of what he was), these actions have nothing to do with the ncaa's stated mission. and it will be near impossible to prove that their motivations were football based and not based on protecting the univ's relationship with the 2nd mile or some other university relationship that has nothing to do with the ncaa. i see why those believe that moving on is the best course of action for penn state. it makes sense. but, there are a lot of people who believe that a huge injustice was done to many innocent people. emmert's words really hurt. he blamed students, faculty, alumni, letterman, coaches, etc for facilitating a culture that allowed a pedophile to roam loose. that's hard to get over. and what was emmert's motivation for doing so? does he really believe penn state's culture was corrupt to the core or did he want to use this as an opportunity to change people's floundering perceptions of his organization? No clue as to Emmert's motivations. As for the 3 on trial..yes, it will be hard to prove that their motivation(s) were football related. But, let's be honest here...if Jerry Sandusky were a janitor in the Engineering Department do you think Spanier, etc. would have taken the same actions as they did with Jerry Sandusky the football coach? look at it this way....sandusky in 2001 was working full time for a charity he founded and he help run. he wasn't a football coach anymore. people outside of state college don't understand how big the 2nd mile was. it was huge in the state of pa. penn state's partnership with the 2nd mile brought a ton of positive publicity for the university. big time politicians, businessmen and celebrities were donors. don't you think it's a strong possibility that penn state administrators shared concerns about sandusky's weird tendencies with others in the 2nd mile? is it possible people in the 2nd mile covered up or made excuses for jerry b/c they were trying to protect their organization? secondly, if there was a cover up as suggested by the state...why hasn't anyone flipped on each other? if spanier told his subordinates to lie or obstruct the investigation, wouldn't they have flipped on him by now to avoid possible jail time? or if curley/schultz lied to spanier, wouldn't spanier have flipped? or if all three worked in unison to obstruct the investigation, wouldn't someone have taken some sort of deal?
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 6, 2013 20:13:34 GMT -5
look at it this way....sandusky in 2001 was working full time for a charity he founded and he help run. he wasn't a football coach anymore. people outside of state college don't understand how big the 2nd mile was. it was huge in the state of pa. penn state's partnership with the 2nd mile brought a ton of positive publicity for the university. big time politicians, businessmen and celebrities were donors. don't you think it's a strong possibility that penn state administrators shared concerns about sandusky's weird tendencies with others in the 2nd mile? is it possible people in the 2nd mile covered up or made excuses for jerry b/c they were trying to protect their organization? secondly, if there was a cover up as suggested by the state...why hasn't anyone flipped on each other? if spanier told his subordinates to lie or obstruct the investigation, wouldn't they have flipped on him by now to avoid possible jail time? or if curley/schultz lied to spanier, wouldn't spanier have flipped? or if all three worked in unison to obstruct the investigation, wouldn't someone have taken some sort of deal? [/quote I believe I'll look at it from the first incident...when he was a full time coach at Penn State. And I think it is very possible that the Second Mile higher ups knew Sandusky was bad news and also looked the other way while money rolled in. Now, if Penn State officials shared concerns about Sandusky.....that is a whole different kettle of fish and it is the last thing Penn State or Second Mile would ever want to be made public. FWIW, I've thought all along that the real bodies were buried at Second Mile. And don't forget that Paterno had big money business dealings with Second Mile as well.
Remains to be seen if anyone flips on each other or not. But, the fact that no one has up to this point doesn't mean all that much. First of all, we don't know if any deal has been offered. Second, we don't know if any subordinate was even involved, much less been offered anything.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 7, 2013 8:12:47 GMT -5
look at it this way....sandusky in 2001 was working full time for a charity he founded and he help run. he wasn't a football coach anymore. people outside of state college don't understand how big the 2nd mile was. it was huge in the state of pa. penn state's partnership with the 2nd mile brought a ton of positive publicity for the university. big time politicians, businessmen and celebrities were donors. don't you think it's a strong possibility that penn state administrators shared concerns about sandusky's weird tendencies with others in the 2nd mile? is it possible people in the 2nd mile covered up or made excuses for jerry b/c they were trying to protect their organization? secondly, if there was a cover up as suggested by the state...why hasn't anyone flipped on each other? if spanier told his subordinates to lie or obstruct the investigation, wouldn't they have flipped on him by now to avoid possible jail time? or if curley/schultz lied to spanier, wouldn't spanier have flipped? or if all three worked in unison to obstruct the investigation, wouldn't someone have taken some sort of deal? [/quote I believe I'll look at it from the first incident...when he was a full time coach at Penn State. And I think it is very possible that the Second Mile higher ups knew Sandusky was bad news and also looked the other way while money rolled in. Now, if Penn State officials shared concerns about Sandusky.....that is a whole different kettle of fish and it is the last thing Penn State or Second Mile would ever want to be made public. FWIW, I've thought all along that the real bodies were buried at Second Mile. And don't forget that Paterno had big money business dealings with Second Mile as well.
Remains to be seen if anyone flips on each other or not. But, the fact that no one has up to this point doesn't mean all that much. First of all, we don't know if any deal has been offered. Second, we don't know if any subordinate was even involved, much less been offered anything. the 1998 incident was fully investigated by outside authorities and skilled professionals who determined that not enough evidence existed to charge sandusky (yet the ncaa blamed paterno anyway). yes, it was shady the way it went down (experts offering contradicting testimony but the one who though sandusky was grooming a victim was ignored). and i'm 100 percent certain that if a janitor were caught in 1998, he'd be immediately terminated. but that is just a reality everywhere. janitors are easily replaceable. popular coaches with likable personalities that have the unique skill set or running a defense at an elite college program are not as replaceable. i see it everyday at work. the flaws of popular co-workers are more likely to be overlooked if that person is liked on a personal level by others b/c we all want to interact with people we like. and sandusky had an extremely endearing personality. paterno was a passive investor in real estate development in state college. real estate investors like paterno have very little idea with what's going on. they have accountants who make sure distributions are being sent when they're supposed to be sent and that's all they care about. it could easily have been that paterno's level of involvement with businessmen in state college was that he wrote a check and his accountant checked in what was being returned. if the real bodies were buried at the Second Mile, wouldn't it make sense to continue investigating their role? a guy like sandusky gets away with these horrible crimes for at least a decade and only his ex employer is held accountable? those who worked with jerry at the second mile were not only trained experts in identifying pedophilia's, but also much more likely to witness first hand how jerry interacted with children. if he was grooming a child, they should have known. that high school of victim 1 knew for months how close jerry was with the victim and they escaped public scrutiny, yet paterno is lambasted by the media for waiting 1 day to call the athletic director and administrative head of campus police. the whole thing is extremely mind boggling.
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 7, 2013 11:50:01 GMT -5
the 1998 incident was fully investigated by outside authorities and skilled professionals who determined that not enough evidence existed to charge sandusky (yet the ncaa blamed paterno anyway). yes, it was shady the way it went down (experts offering contradicting testimony but the one who though sandusky was grooming a victim was ignored). and i'm 100 percent certain that if a janitor were caught in 1998, he'd be immediately terminated. but that is just a reality everywhere. janitors are easily replaceable. popular coaches with likable personalities that have the unique skill set or running a defense at an elite college program are not as replaceable. i see it everyday at work. the flaws of popular co-workers are more likely to be overlooked if that person is liked on a personal level by others b/c we all want to interact with people we like. and sandusky had an extremely endearing personality. paterno was a passive investor in real estate development in state college. real estate investors like paterno have very little idea with what's going on. they have accountants who make sure distributions are being sent when they're supposed to be sent and that's all they care about. it could easily have been that paterno's level of involvement with businessmen in state college was that he wrote a check and his accountant checked in what was being returned. if the real bodies were buried at the Second Mile, wouldn't it make sense to continue investigating their role? a guy like sandusky gets away with these horrible crimes for at least a decade and only his ex employer is held accountable? those who worked with jerry at the second mile were not only trained experts in identifying pedophilia's, but also much more likely to witness first hand how jerry interacted with children. if he was grooming a child, they should have known. that high school of victim 1 knew for months how close jerry was with the victim and they escaped public scrutiny, yet paterno is lambasted by the media for waiting 1 day to call the athletic director and administrative head of campus police. the whole thing is extremely mind boggling. Shady doesn't begin to describe 1998. And Sandusky the janitor would not just have been fired, he would have been prosecuted as well. I totally agree that the Second Mile should be investigated. If you're looking for people to "flip" that, imo, is the most logical place. And once again you are giving a pass to Paterno...on the one hand you talk about how the money involved with Second Mile was a corrupting influence on others but when when it comes to Paterno you dismiss it as probably just some hands off kind of deal. For you, this is all about Joe Paterno and his legacy. And I really don't understand that. The top administrators at your school looked the other way while a predator ran loose. And all you seem to care about is Joe Paterno.
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Post by ihs82 on Sept 7, 2013 18:42:14 GMT -5
Shady doesn't begin to describe 1998. And Sandusky the janitor would not just have been fired, he would have been prosecuted as well. I totally agree that the Second Mile should be investigated. If you're looking for people to "flip" that, imo, is the most logical place. And once again you are giving a pass to Paterno...on the one hand you talk about how the money involved with Second Mile was a corrupting influence on others but when when it comes to Paterno you dismiss it as probably just some hands off kind of deal. For you, this is all about Joe Paterno and his legacy. And I really don't understand that. The top administrators at your school looked the other way while a predator ran loose. And all you seem to care about is Joe Paterno.
let the courts decide before we make inflammatory comments like "your school looked the other way while a predator ran loose." as for paterno...one aspect of this scandal i do care about is the ncaa's punishment of penn state. and the ncaa punished penn state based on paterno's role. the ncaa took the freeh report, which accused paterno of criminally covering up the actions of a pedophile, as basis to punish penn state. this is both false and unfair. there is no evidence to back up the ncaa's claim.
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Post by beuycek on Sept 8, 2013 5:30:46 GMT -5
let the courts decide before we make inflammatory comments like "your school looked the other way while a predator ran loose." as for paterno...one aspect of this scandal i do care about is the ncaa's punishment of penn state. and the ncaa punished penn state based on paterno's role. the ncaa took the freeh report, which accused paterno of criminally covering up the actions of a pedophile, as basis to punish penn state. this is both false and unfair. there is no evidence to back up the ncaa's claim. Agree 100% on the Paterno piece and consider this, if this whole situation had not been linked to Paterno and Penn State the coverage is nowhere near what it turned into. ESPN would not have camped out and reported on it during every SportsCenter episode, etc. In some ways, it is good that the program was associated with it because it brought some much needed attention to a problem that is probably even bigger than what has been reported in the PSU case but on the other hand, the finger was unfairly pointed at the wrong individuals in an attempt to sensationalize things and have certain agendas met. At least based on what we know now anyway.
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Post by oujour76 on Sept 8, 2013 20:28:40 GMT -5
Agree 100% on the Paterno piece and consider this, if this whole situation had not been linked to Paterno and Penn State the coverage is nowhere near what it turned into. ESPN would not have camped out and reported on it during every SportsCenter episode, etc. In some ways, it is good that the program was associated with it because it brought some much needed attention to a problem that is probably even bigger than what has been reported in the PSU case but on the other hand, the finger was unfairly pointed at the wrong individuals in an attempt to sensationalize things and have certain agendas met. At least based on what we know now anyway. Fair or not, Paterno was the public face of Penn State. And the media had spent the last umpteen years telling us how "JoePa" was in charge and Penn State was a shining example of how college athletics should be run and on and on and on. So, when the school is found to have had a child predator on its hands for 20 years or so the obvious question was...where the hell was JoePa? So, of course the media focused on Joe Paterno. Why would anyone expect otherwise? That is what the media does.
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